tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post8030265695937538752..comments2024-03-21T07:58:02.168-05:00Comments on Amateur Mormon Historian: In search of a songBrucehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01543519825711760773noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-43770920720049672692011-05-18T10:47:59.572-05:002011-05-18T10:47:59.572-05:00I have found nothing else. I would love to hear yo...I have found nothing else. I would love to hear you grandmother sing it. Would be willing to record her and send it to me?Brucehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01543519825711760773noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-35497304881280398182011-05-17T23:10:15.398-05:002011-05-17T23:10:15.398-05:00I know I'm coming late to the party, but tonig...I know I'm coming late to the party, but tonight my 90-year-old grandma suddenly recalled this song and started singing in her quavering elderly voice. Have you found any further information? I might try recording my grandmother for the melody, unless you have the music printed somewhere.Garyatricshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18139992645373976602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-11329356011544342192010-06-13T16:53:03.087-05:002010-06-13T16:53:03.087-05:00Thank you so much for posting about this song and ...Thank you so much for posting about this song and the story of the mob. I loved the story when I first read it. I also tried to find a tune or any reference to the lyrics. When I read the journal, I assumed it was a familiar tune. If the elders knew it well enough to sing it without notice and Peter Johnson remembered the lyrics well enough to jot it in his journal. Such a mystery!Mark and Marianne Eganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17994182563769783296noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-26185740855336840992010-06-07T16:24:21.804-05:002010-06-07T16:24:21.804-05:00Thanks Amy. If you like this, just wait til you re...Thanks Amy. If you like this, just wait til you read the story about the song.Brucehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01543519825711760773noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-34217850983180231662010-06-07T14:40:49.432-05:002010-06-07T14:40:49.432-05:00Wow. Interesting search. Nice to get some libraria...Wow. Interesting search. Nice to get some librarians working on the search, and Coffinberry's comments on the song are very interesting and detailed.Amy Thttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04037263182287268748noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-24125940166233545632010-06-07T10:00:48.700-05:002010-06-07T10:00:48.700-05:00Coffinberry,
I think your qualifications are as go...Coffinberry,<br />I think your qualifications are as good as any of the librarians I have consulted already, perhaps more so. <br /><br />The elements of the song suggested to me that it was written outside Tennessee, by those who had left for some reason possibly during post civil war reconstruction. I hadn't thought of the the possibility of it being modified just for Mormons being forced from Tennessee. That would make it far more interesting.<br /><br />As for the context, I have a post for tomorrow that will explain in more detail.<br /><br />To be honest I have not kept track of the songs I have eliminated from my search, though I probably should have. And the fact that "I" am searching for it will tell you more about me than about the song (i. e. that I am easily distracted by the task of verifying minor details of larger stories).<br /><br />And from the text I have, there does not appear to be any lines missong from the chorus.Brucehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01543519825711760773noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-71734037064507612072010-06-07T08:35:10.640-05:002010-06-07T08:35:10.640-05:00(Let me know if I'm covering ground you've...(Let me know if I'm covering ground you've already covered...)<br /><br />The Civil War ballad "On the Shores of Tennessee" offers a similar closing-couplet pairing of "freeman" with "Tennessee," and is rhythmically similar, but does not seem to share other elements.<br /><br />(Is there a line missing from the offered transcript...? there are seven lines, but I would expect eight.)Coffinberryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02733100127011713348noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-7594851680710537952010-06-07T08:02:10.149-05:002010-06-07T08:02:10.149-05:00Bruce,
I really don't know. My only qualifica...Bruce,<br /><br />I really don't know. My only qualifications for commenting are that minor was music composition, I once took a folk-lore class at BYU, I once lived in Tennessee, I've been spending the past month trying to put together some old-time gospel songs from memory for a (largely non-LDS) family reunion next month, and musical group the Carter Family has a significant place in the random music rotation on my computer--in other words, certainly not as qualified as the people you've already consulted! I agree that the song is puzzling (and intriguing), and can see why those you've spoken with were instantly invested in finding the answer! <br /><br />Assuming it is a laurel tree spoken of, that would suggest an Appalachian origin; but references to both the Tennessee and Mississippi rivers suggest an origin in the western end of the state. Indeed, the pairing of the two suggests that the place-location of the original song might be Kentucky instead of Tennessee.<br /><br />The "exodus"-type references are also puzzling... because clearly someone is leaving the state, but wishing to come back because it is so beautiful there (alas, I too have been there, done that). The reason for leaving seems to have to do with freedom, but it doesn't sound like a reference to antebellum slavery, because the singer states that the people leaving had thought they were free before, but apparently learned that they were not. That would work, I suppose, for post-reconstruction conditions, which would match the timeframe. If the song were much older than 1897, a better fit would be the relocation of "the Five Civilized Tribes" in 1838. <br /><br />The rhythmical similarities don't say much, really. It's just what it made me think of reading it in my head. If I were setting the text to music, I'd use a guitar, and a basic I-IV-V7 chordset. I can imagine it in both 4/4 and 3/4.<br /><br />The fact that *you* are the one searching for it suggests that you found it in an LDS context; and that it's a song written in somebody's journal, and possibly reflecting someone feeling like they have to move 'west' (as in out to Utah) because their brand of religion just isn't accepted where they are. And that makes me think that it's an adaptation of some other song.Coffinberryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02733100127011713348noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-91781842835665604132010-06-07T00:26:02.587-05:002010-06-07T00:26:02.587-05:00Ardis,
The librarians have been wonderful here, no...Ardis,<br />The librarians have been wonderful here, not just on this search but on many others as well.<br /><br />Cofinberry,<br />I'm guessing the person who wrote it down did so from memory, and may have leanred the song by ear so "Laurel tree" is quite probable. But even with that change nothing pops up in online searches.<br /><br />Do you think the similarities in meter, period of origin (1880's), and even subject matter (a girl from Tennessee?) might tell us something about the source for this song?Brucehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01543519825711760773noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-10392063851088790362010-06-06T23:14:43.279-05:002010-06-06T23:14:43.279-05:00Another observation... rhythmically it is a good m...Another observation... rhythmically it is a good match for Wabash Cannonball.Coffinberryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02733100127011713348noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-51078740429599364482010-06-06T23:11:13.594-05:002010-06-06T23:11:13.594-05:00A thought (that I"m following up on)... could...A thought (that I"m following up on)... could that be "we love the Laurel tree"?Coffinberryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02733100127011713348noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2645379631135547997.post-59528249412998406382010-06-06T15:45:08.831-05:002010-06-06T15:45:08.831-05:00Your doggedness is admirable, and the enthusiasm o...Your doggedness is admirable, and the enthusiasm of your librarians is inspiration -- imagine their becoming so wrapped up in your search that they made your query their own this way! <br /><br />I've got nothing to offer in the way of a solution, but kudos to your librarians.Ardishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08112106471041509720noreply@blogger.com